Toro Premier Debates - Round Seven // ends sunday-midnight

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Rosy
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Re: Toro Premier Debates - Round Seven // ends sunday-midnig

Post: # 12254Post Rosy »

The debate's moderator would tell Shiv off for the aggression and swearing, and if he continued he'd be escorted out. and his mom will be told.
(( this is a little late. but i'm going to post it to remind people that this is a civil moderated debate, pls, be aware that angry yelling from audience members-or even the candidates! outrageous name calling/insults/ random tangents- isn't going to be just waved off // as in if someone starts yelling and cursing, they'll probably be interrupted & told off/ shooed away / escorted out if they start being extra bad . so please thinking about this in your further posts!~ Go ahead and try to tho ofc - if you have any question on what would be interrupted or not, feel free to skype me! Though generally the rule is: anything aggressive = plsstop ur not in trouble tho shadey ilu ))
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bigpapa671
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Re: Toro Premier Debates - Round Seven // ends sunday-midnig

Post: # 12265Post bigpapa671 »

Heather would look out to the current foreign minister and give him a small nod. "For starters Mister Foreign Minister, I'd like to thank you for your time in service to Toro, and I hope you enjoy your retirement. I am sure you are not new to debates, so you will not take my criticism of your policy as personal attack but instead discourse between peers. I will address your arguments against my policies, and the things I have said"

"For starters, your statement that we "participate from a distance" as you've put it. You say that this is what's best for Toro but I am going to have to disagree. You claim that a region as small as ours risks making enemies by declaring friendships but in the same broad stroke you paint a standing army only as a tool of oppression, and intimidation. Mister Bryant if we are to both not make any strong allies, and declaw ourselves by avoiding a standing military we will simply be eaten alive by the next up-start imperialist that decides they want to knock on our door. You may view these isolationist policies as preserving the peace, and perhaps they do in the short term. But if Toro as a nation were to continue to standing for nothing, what will it fall for? If we refuse to create solid bonds, and friendships why would anyone wish to help us in the case of an invasion? We live in the global age Mister Bryant, if you choose not to play the game then eventually you will be dragged into it. We need to do everything in our power to keep that from happening to us as a Region. The only way for us to truly win the game is to join in with the other regions working towards global peace. We help nobody by sitting on our hands"

The young woman would take a sip of her water before continuing with her response "Now Mister Bryant you forget yourself, the circumstances of where I am from do not affect my opinion on how Toro should be run. I am a Toran first and foremost, and I only have Toro's best interest at heart. Your isolationist policies put a choke-hold on economics, and will mean disaster if we do not globalize. You claim we are not stagnating, and instead we are peaceful and prosperous, but that means nothing. Every major region in world history that had a volatile economic crisis was peaceful, and prosperous directly beforehand. Make no mistake if we do not globalize, in this day, and age, then we will most definitely stagnate, and it will take years to undo all of the economic damage that will be done."

"Now as for your point on any standing army Toro being able to create being far too small to protect us" she'd clear her throat "How much do you know about military strategy Mister Bryant? I myself served many years in a military, and I would point you to the recent issues in the green islands in which a single regiment of Lyuskovian deserters, and a fighting force made up of regular citizens from the islands managed to prevent the Areniscan Military, which you will recognize as one of the most powerful fascist forces in the world, from invading them. The Island of Toro could easily protect itself from invasion with only a small, well trained, military."

"You call my policies dangerous, and narrow minded, but the truth is Mister Bryant that label more aptly fits your libertarian policies. You think just because Toro has not reached out to other nations to have embassies, to work together to make the world a better place that it has kept us safe? Poppycock, all that you've done is left us alone in an ever changing world, drifting amongst a sea of strange faces, instead of being surrounded by allies, and friends. The tides of globalization will not simply avoid Toro because of our isolationist policies, instead they will envelop us and we will not be ready. You claim you want to keep Toro safe, healthy, and happy but the truth is that we will not have a sustainable peace such as this unless the entire world is safe, healthy, and happy. Has it been so long since the great war that we have forgotten the pain that results from everyone sitting and stewing in their own corner? This is the first time in the course of human, and pixelmon history that we can have actual world peace, and policies like yours prevent that. It's not about glory, or valor, and interventionism as you try to paint it. It's about helping every single person on this planet, Black, White, Unovan, Lyuskovian, Kantonese! Toro is a region built on people from all over working together, it would be wrong of us to sit out when the world has its first chance at creating true world peace."

Heather would take a deep breath after the long winded answer "Now onto questions of legality, and power structure. I have stated many times over that I will not be directly doing things as Premier, instead using the office of Premier to work alongside the Foreign Minister to do these things. Under our current system the Premier has worked on foreign policy alongside the Foreign Minister before, and I am sure they will again whether I am elected or not. I am not circumventing checks and balances by any means."

Heather nods ready to give him a final statement "If you truly value that Toro is happy, and healthy at home you will see that the only way to maintain this happiness is by working with allies, and friends abroad"
Sn0wfa11
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Re: Toro Premier Debates - Round Seven // ends sunday-midnig

Post: # 12266Post Sn0wfa11 »

Tide smiles placidly and pushes a hand through his short blond hair before replying, "To put it plainly, our current peace and economic prosperity is something to be proud of and carefully cultivate, not to denigrate and belittle, as you do, in order to justify reckless and cavalier globalist dreams. You see Toro as crumbling, but the rest of us know it is healing and growing, if apparently too peacefully and quietly for you to hear it. But beyond that, it is precisely the fragility of our current existence that prompts and in fact demands the caution you so disparaged- caution that has worked: my record," he says simply, projecting but not in a forceful manner, "speaks for itself. As others have pointed out earlier this evening, so, regrettably, does yours."

Tide adjusts the crisp cuffs of his white shirt, and concludes, "I pray for my children's sake that your foolish endeavors will be merely a waste rather than a disaster, and fortunately, Ms. Penn likely has the foresight to limit your dangerous adventurism's harms to our country. Nonetheless I find myself, despite previously being concerned but on the proverbial fence, now compelled to throw my support behind Ms. Aruji, and I would encourage everyone to do the same. That will be all- I'm happy to give you the last word, for after all these are your debates, and others may have many more questions than I." He sits down once more and continues to watch neutrally.

His fourteen year old daughter, or one of the two, Kaia, a slim child of middling height with a shirt that's absolutely covered in dirt and mud for unknown reasons, is unfortunately less polite than him, and sticks out her tongue at Heather from somewhere else in the crowd. She's positioned such that it's easily visible to nearly everyone but her father, and makes sure to do it while he's distracted.
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bigpapa671
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Re: Toro Premier Debates - Round Seven // ends sunday-midnig

Post: # 12267Post bigpapa671 »

Heather would shake her head looking out to Tide "No sir you misunderstand me, I do not consider the peace, and prosperity we have all worked so hard to bring about as something to degenerate, and belittle. But I see them for the double edged blade they are. I am proud of where Toro has come, and I am up here actively working trying to keep the peace going. I am trying to take advantage of the peace we have earned in order to bring a much longer lasting peace. Globalization is coming Tide, soon it will be a fact of life, and we must ensure that we keep up with it so we don't lose everything we have earned. I am not here to belittle the work that has been done thus far, instead I am using it as a perfect launching point to better Toro." Heather takes a deep breath "At least give me that Mister Foreign Minister, know that I am working to continue the peace, not to end it."

She smiles weakly "It is nice to hear that you will be engaging in your civic duty and voting Mister Bryant. But before you so quickly back a candidate I ask you to consider this" she takes a sip of her water before she continues talking "It is true that you disagree with me yes, but from what little has been presented by my opposition you know that she as well is planning on opening Toro's relations with certain regions, but unlike myself she has not presented how, or why she would do it" She smiles stronger at Tide now "Mister Foreign Minister today we have disagreed on at least 5 different fronts, we have never agreed once. But when all is said is done you know that I have beliefs. You've been able to so eloquently fight me because you know exactly what I want to do from the start. Are you truly willing to vote with a candidate who you also do not agree with, but who has a less concrete understanding of policy, who has given you sentences where I have given paragraphs, who is simply not as equipped for leadership?"

Heather gives him one last nod "What I mean to say Tide is, based on the things you have said today, you would disagree with both of our policies, yet my policy is so much more detailed, and has at least been proven to work since it is the status quo in every other region. Do you truly disagree with me so much that you would vote for a woman who you also disagree with, who's very stance is vague and possibly far more harmful for Toro in your eyes?"
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Portalgunblaze
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Re: Toro Premier Debates - Round Seven // ends sunday-midnig

Post: # 12268Post Portalgunblaze »

Jade let out a grunt and stood up, making sure to get everyone's attention before she spoke. "Now Miss Nikitas, let me explain you a few things. First, our policies are not the same and those are for good reasons. I can't agree on a lot of things you say, for good reasons ofcourse. To simply say our policies are the same and you shouldn't go for mine just shows how you are so focused on yourself, you can't be bothered to do the tiniest bit of research on others. A basic example would be that I am fully against a military, as I voiced in the begin of this debate, while you are for it.

While I do admit, yes, my policy is a little less detailed than yours in how we should deal with other regions, I'll explain right now why this is the case. The Premier, the position I'm going for, is not the Foreign Minister and Premier. I want to be able to properly work with the Foreign Minister, while I want to improve relations with other regions and the United Nations, which we are a part of incase you forgot. I'm not as focused on our Foreign affairs as the Foreign Minisrter should be. I just have things I want to accomplish by working with them, not being their boss. If I bring up a change I wanna make or something else I wanna do, and the Foreign Minister is heavily advising me not to do so, I will listen to them instead of constantly trying to prove myself right and shoving my head in the dirt like a Duduo.

Now to say your policies are the status quo in every other region, I'm sorry I have to say this, but it just shows how ignorant you are. Let me just list of some examples partaining to military, a big part of your policies. Most island nations like Toro, do NOT have a standing military. And a good amount of regions, like Holova, only took up a military after being attacked. Other regions also see foreign relationships far different, such as my previous example Holova, who focuses much more on trade agreements than anything else, seeing as they make a large amount of their income because of it. Now, to continue on stuff which you haven't said which is not true, which is what I've had to talk about for most of this debate now. Not every economic crisis in history was peaceful or stagnating. Some regions have gone into economic crisis right after war, because war is something extremely expensive. Other's have gone into economic crisis because they were too focused on globalizing and because of that their market crashed.
To say your policies are the status quo in every other region, is not just wrong, it's also very misleading.

Now, for my final point. You're saying that my policies are far more dangerous than yours, but I'm not the person calling peace a double edged sword and suggesting a military. On the topic of peace. I believe a region like Toro can fully and easily develop like we are doing now, while in peace, without a military. To continue a bit on military, if peace is a double edged blade, then military is as well. A military, in time of war, would be good. But we are not in a time of war, getting a military now will only weaken the relations we have with other regions, because we are basically saying 'Hey we think some of you may want to invade us in the future.' and we're wasting money on it."
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Re: Toro Premier Debates - Round Seven // ends sunday-midnig

Post: # 12271Post bigpapa671 »

Heather would shake her head to Jade "I didn't say our policies are the same, I said that our policies are both based on increasing foreign relations with other regions which the current Foreign Minister believes to be dangerous, and you don't only have a less detailed foreign policy then me ma'am you have a less detailed everything, but I will address that later on in the debate. I'll chunk my response into four portions"

"For starters you say that most island regions don't have standing armies? I'd like you to please tell that to Avalon, Hoenn, the green islands, and almost every other island region which does indeed have a standing army." Heather would shake her head at Jade before moving on "I believe you also said that other nations didn't "pick up" a standing army until they were attacked. So you mean to tell me that a lack of an army didn't prevent from being invaded? You'd rather have Toro wait till we already have foreign invaders assaulting our people to found a basic tool in defending one's self?"

"Now onto other regions seeing foreign relationships differently." Heather takes a sip of her water "It would seem you haven't actually even read my platform because I emphasis trade far more than I do a standing army or the peace corps that come with it. It states multiple times over that the most crucial part of my foreign policy is the creation of trade agreements, and research pacts with other nations in order to bring on a technological boom, and to bring economic prosperity to Toro" Heather smiles

"Speaking of economic prosperity, I never said that every economic crisis happened in times of peace, stagnation, or isolationism. I said all of the major ones have, which is true. Unova in the 930's, Lyuskoy in the 920's, the panic of 847" Heather rolls her shoulders slightly "Please point to a region in which globalization has caused massive econimic depression even half as close as to these events? You can not come up here and state things as if they are fact without actually providing examples. I can't believe you' are saying that I am the one saying untrue things, yet you have not provided a single example of anything untrue I've said in the entire debate. I've managed to point out more than one false claim you've made Mrs. Aruji which in all honesty is amazing since you've spoken so much but said so little."

"Now onto your last point, moving back to the standing army. To say a standing army sends out a hostile message to other Regions is silly. Why would other regions be offended by our raising of a standing army when more than 95% of them have a standing army. Its like saying creating a police force is a bad idea because it would make the citizens distrust us because we are assuming they will commit crimes. I'd much rather have a standing army that can defend us rather then have no army, and wait till invasion to found one. You yourself said that other nations didn't raise an army until invasion, which I reiterate meant that the lack of an army did nothing to deter an invasion."

"Your policies are dangerous to Mister Bryant because of their content, but to me they are dangerous because of their lack there of. You aren't telling us how you plan on doing anything, I mean half of your budgetary priorities are things Premier Sam Knighton already did. For example giving grants, Sam already set up a grant system unless you're saying you'll give grants using Sam's initial system, then congratulations on telling us you'll do your job. Sam Knighton already created teams that respond to emergency situations in the ERTs. You're positions are so vague that either they've been done before or you don't tell us nearly enough for us to actually know how you plan on achieving these things. You have no substance. You want a more democratic system yet you present no way to make the system more democratic. I want a more democratic system, and I explain how my referendum legislation would do that. You say you want to work on our global standing, and relationships with other regions, you don't say how. When I say I want to work with other nations I present actual policy that will achieve that. I honestly don't even understand why you're up here Jade because it seems you haven't put any actual thought into your platform, at least from what you've shown us "
Last edited by bigpapa671 on Sun Oct 02, 2016 12:57 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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FollowTheBuzzard
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Re: Toro Premier Debates - Round Seven // ends sunday-midnig

Post: # 12274Post FollowTheBuzzard »

Standing up from his seat in the audience Kiliona Manu would straighten the tie of his suit a bit before clearing his throat and speaking up. "Umm excuse me, I have a question. Mrs. Nikitas, Jade has already been asked about her policy to want to move the Pix Co factory, but I noticed you were excluded from the question and didn't get a proper response. As someone who owns a farm there how do you feel about moving the Factory?"
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bigpapa671
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Re: Toro Premier Debates - Round Seven // ends sunday-midnig

Post: # 12275Post bigpapa671 »

Heather would nod to Kiliona as she fixes her jacket slightly "Thank you Mister Manu, I was hoping I would get a chance to respond to this in the debate. My opponent wants to move the Pix Co factory because it "could be" quiet harmful. Of course there have been no studies showing this, she isn't suggesting testing to see if it's harmful, she on a whim decided because it is a factory it must ruin farm land, but considering it is a mechanical plant, not a chemical plant it it doesn't have run off that could actually ruin farmland. This entire idea just shows a misunderstanding of how factories work. Moving the factory would halt production, and waste money. Not to mention that's privately owned land, the Premier cant even move it if they wanted to. It's literally not in Jade's power to do that if elected."
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Misha
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Re: Toro Premier Debates - Round Seven // ends sunday-midnig

Post: # 12276Post Misha »

Once Heather finished speaking a blonde Kantonese woman stood up from the crowd, one some would recognize to be Lana Kiesin. " This is for both candidates. I am sure you both have heard about how the rangers recently acquired a baby Entei from Garnet Island, and how they brought it back to watch over in the ranger base. " the woman reminded them monotonously, eyes scanning the two carefully. " What your thoughts on this incident? " she questioned without emotion.
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bigpapa671
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Re: Toro Premier Debates - Round Seven // ends sunday-midnig

Post: # 12277Post bigpapa671 »

Heather would smile out to Lana, the sight of the woman seemingly comforting her "Good question Mrs. Kiesen. I believe that the way the Entei was handled was incredibly reckless. From my understanding the rangers took an incredibly rare, powerful pixelmon away from it's home. From what I've been told it was apparently moved to protect the residents of the Island, all 4 of them. The Issue I have with that is it was moved into an all wooden base in one of the most populated cities in Toro." Heather shakes her head "There have been reports that the base was fire proofed but the whole thing is made of wood, there is no logical way they can fireproof it all. Even if they did manage to fireproof an all wooden base I am 100% sure they did not fire proof the entire forest behind it. Had that Entei escaped it could have been catastrophic."

Heather would take a small sip of water "Were I to be elected Premier I would do two things. For starters Arbiter LeGrand, and I have already spoken about passing legislation that will protect these pixelmon. Premier Knighton's CIDA already prevents the poaching of these "legendary pixelmon" as the law refers to them, but we will go a step further, and insure that Civilians are never actively handling these pixelmon without government over site. The second thing I'd do after passing this legislation is help the RTMP get everything they need to securely hold these pixelmon, that way they are not taken to one of the most populated cities in Toro again. The Rangers of course can still work as volunteers alongside the RTMP but we can not trust such power into the hands of civilians alone. We need our police force to act here to maintain accountability, and I would make sure they have everything they need to do so."
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